Tuesday, March 4, 2008

Tuesday 21 miles

I shackled my HR monitor back on today and stuck my HR at 140-145 (averaged 143) for 21 miles/ 2:20.


Wassdoc said...

Good luck to everyone on Saturday, you'll have a great time. I wish that I could be there, but I'll be out of town. I've been wanting to weigh in on Coach Lucho's aerobic approach. It has certainly worked for me. I was mid pack 46 year old three years ago and three years of this type of training and done wonders for me. I used to be slower and more injury prone, now I'm faster and have had no injuries. Last February, on three months of the type of training Coach Lucho is talking about, I PR'd in a half marathon by 5 minutes. When I review my training logs, for those three months, I spent 54% in zone 1, 26% in zone 2, 7% in zone 3 and 1% in zone 4. Ironically, almost none of the time was spent at my ultimate 1/2 marathon pace! Most of my zone 3 runs were done @ about 7:30 pace, and I completed the half in 1:32 (7:03 pace)! This approach works. Be patient and keep at it. It is true, initially it seems easy, but as you progress it will feel harder as you speed up, but your HR stays the same. After awhile, you'll be running faster when it comes race time! For three years I have PR'd in the majority of my races from sprint to half ironman distance. By the way, the same principles work on the bike! Have a great time on Saturday.

kerrie said...

alright, off to find a monitor so i can crush GZ ;)....i will plan on being there.

Chuckie V said...

I'm interested to hear the results! Be sure everyone warm-ups enough...a lap walk, 4 laps jog, 4 laps near MAF, test. I wish I was there!

GZ said...

I'd love to be there and I'd love to be dusted and I really love to have my thinking challenged. But I have a different race to be at (unless the timing works out differently): the PINEWOOD DERBY. Given how much MAF work JZ has put into the GREEN TIGER, I'd not miss that for the world.

I have not made a definitive decision on this one way or another. I agree with the general approach, but I have an issue with understanding why doing in anything above MAF is inappropriate, particularly on different days from when you specifically stay below MAF.

For example, what if I run at MAF or below for 2 hours and then I go above MAF (burn fat for 2 hours and then eat glycogen - yum)?

I might make it, I'd love to but if I miss the derby, I am writing my own deserved ticket to hell.

Lucho said...

GZ- So by your line of thinking.. you believe that what I am doing is incorrect? And that you are satisfied with your past results and current fitness because of the way that you train now?

GZ said...

Okay, I guess I stepped in it there.

I'd be an idiot to say what you are doing is incorrect. Particularly at this point when you are regularly a speck in the distance to me three minutes into our runs.

I would say this: while not all roads lead to Rome, there is more than one way to get there.

Am I satisfied with where I am at? Nope. I will always look to improve. When I grow uninterested in improving in something, I will probably not compete in it (I might still do it, but measure improvement in other not easily measured ways). And that is why I am considering MAF training. The part that I struggle with is the entire "don't do a push up" part (okay you and Chuck did not say that exactly but strict Maffetonians have) because it makes you anaerobic and then you have blown everything. I am wondering if there can be benefit gained by having days that are MAF oriented while other days are not. Chuck has said this approach has not worked as well as for him. And that is cool. But a case study of one a case does not make.

Part of my personal concern is that I did a lot of stuff real easy last year (mountain stuff). Maybe my HR was above MAF when I was doing that and I was losing both aerobic fitness and speed (because I run slower on 10 percent grades). My concern is engaging in a program that has me running slower at this point when I am trying to get some of those wheels back. Logically, yes - I hear the LSD becomes long steady and then long speedy distance - but again - the piece I don't get is why no above the MAF work for 12 weeks.

And I confess, the science of the answer will probably confuse the crap out of me anyway.

Lucho said...

You say you want to get "speed" back.. your goal is Pikes Peak? What do you think your fastest mile will be at this years Pikes Peak race? Work until you can run a mile at that pace.. then you have all the speed you need. If you can't hold it for 26 miles then you are lacking endurance.. of which the MAF method is 100% focused on.
Also, the MAF method is not a 365 day program- you do it until you get fit enough to hammer. What Chuck and I are saying is that you have a weak foundation and you are trying to pile speed and tempo work on top of this weak foundation. You will not be able to push your fitness higher than your base endurance. In other words.. in 20 weeks after I have become aerobically strong and efficient enough to run 5:30 pace per mile while jogging at HR 145.. where do you think I will be able to go from there? MUCH faster. You on the other hand will have run hard every week and built your lactate threshold to 5:30 pace.. and that's the end, you're at your best.. If you run tempo work year around.. then when it comes time to prepare to get fast then where do you go? You will not be able to do more tempo or faster tempo.
What I propose to you is to run 90 miles per week at HR 135-145 (this will be slow for you because your muscles lack the fitness to not stress your heart). Do this for 6 weeks. Test every week. What you will see happening is that every week you will get faster and faster at the same HR, this is you becoming efficient! If you were to continue this for 12-20 weeks and you plateaued then it comes time to train hard.. and you will have the structure and fitness to train harder than you've ever been able to! You'll be able to run 12-14 mile tempo runs at <6:00 pace and not kill yourself- can you do that now?
Remember too that this concept that is so foreign to you comes directly from Lydiard. It's the oldest and most proven running theory of periodization! What you're proposing is arguably part of the reason for the down fall of American running. Volume is important.. and intensity hurts your ability to run volume.

BRFOOT said...

That was the best total explanation yet. I think the piece that most of us miss, me included. Is we do not push the volume through those 12 weeks. I think the most miles I got up during my 12 week seesion was 53-55. At this point I started seeing a plateau. What I probably should have done is add more volume over the last 6 weeks. Which is exactly what I will do in my next base session. And by the way, even the way I did it I was able to improve my half marathon time by 7 min. on the same course with worse conditions, so I'm sold.